--seems like airline terror is the new fad. Just wondering if I am the only one who is seriously debating setting foot on a plane... reg
(and I heard the guy had C-4 in his shoes) reg
It's true that you are more likely to get into an accident while driving than on a plane, I feel [at the moment atleast] safer on land only because I think that high up, you're pretty vulnerable. If you get into an accident on the ground, there's a chance you can make it out alive. If some nutjob blows his shoes up in a plane at that high altitude..or decides to fly into a building....well....that's it. I guess that's why I feel the way I do.
aren't I just full of Holiday cheer..heh.
reg
- The Klaive reg
-John
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-bReAkZ nATiOnZ-
- breakznation@aol.com
- AIM: highlord42o reg
quote:
Originally posted by Klaive:
I Fear Nothing.- The Klaive
Yes you do. You fear non-virgin women <cackle> reg
A small amount of C4 like the one on the guys shoes would need an electrical current to run through it to go poof.
- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard
[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 12-23-2001).] reg
Nothing you can do if its your time.
Buckwheet reg
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I got no dukes. reg
quote:
Originally posted by LordKranar:
C4 doesn't explode from being lit unless there are extremly high amounts of it, which is why the plane didn't explode.A small amount of C4 like the one on the guys shoes would need an electrical current to run through it to go poof.
they say that he could have had a half pound of the stuff jammed in his shoes...
and if he had turned his feet towards the exterior walls, he sould have blown a hole through the side of the plane... This would have brought the plane down!
Let's face it.. all middle eastern men HAVE to be treated like they have the potential to be terrorists!
Sorry if that sounds harsh.
I'm flying to Vegas in January... If there's ONE arab male on that plane, I'm requesting that he be removed. Period. No questions asked!
reg
quote:
Originally posted by Buckwheet:
Not afraid at all.Nothing you can do if its your time.
Buckwheet
Well I'm trying to stall that time...heh reg
quote:
Originally posted by SirLoinOfBeef:
I'm flying to Vegas in January... If there's ONE arab male on that plane, I'm requesting that he be removed. Period. No questions asked!
Interesting fact you'll find in a lot of different races/nationalities--their physical traits vary greatly within the nationality. I.E: One of my friends from that region is very, very dark skinned-- he could (and has) easily pass as an African American. Another friend (I think Palestinian)is very fair skinned and could just as easily pass as a Caucasian. At the same token, I am always mistaken for Arabic, even by Arabic people, but I'm Spanish and Native American. Not all Arabic people have that "Osama" look, that same shade of brown skin color and black hair. The one person you think is harmless boarding the plane in January...could be the one to light a stick of dynamite..heh.
Also, I wouldn't isolate airline terror just to Arabic people. I think this whole incident [has] sparked a lot of different things--people who are just mentally unstable like the idea of hijacking a plane--I don't believe the mental patient who attempted to charge into the cockpit of that Chicago flight a week or two after Sept. 11 was Middle Eastern. (Was he?)
My paranoia has no bounds.<cough>
reg
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I got no dukes. reg
Get a private jet. That's what they're for, after all. ::shrugs::
- The Klaive reg
I just flew to Atlanta and back this past weekend and got "randomly searched" both times .. which is where they run a hand-held metal detector over you and check your carry-on baggage.
<shrug> I'm flying to Miami in a few days, we'll see how it is down there. reg
quote:
Originally posted by Klaive:
Why is it such a big issue anyway? You're scared of Terrorists on airplanes? Simple solution.Get a private jet. That's what they're for, after all. ::shrugs::
- The Klaive
Yeah I'm going to see if I can get my boyfriend to get me one from Walmart. reg
-John
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-bReAkZ nATiOnZ-
- breakznation@aol.com
- AIM: highlord42o reg
The problem that needs to be enforced and improved is what happens IN the plane once off the ground. The crew needs to be trained for hostile situations, there should be sky marshalls armed with some sort of immobolization device, and have the crew carry them as well.
If someone wants to hurt or cause problems, they'll find a way to do it. I would feel much better flying if I knew that the stewardess and/or pilot would make an effort to actively stop a terrorist, rather than tremble in fear with the passengers. I put my life in their hands, and I feel it is their duty to uphold that. I have never been of the opinion that stewards are just waiters. They are airplane crew and should do everything in their means to protect the passengers, and should be trained and physically able to do so.
Seeing as how I've had to spend over 6 hours of my traveling time just in getting in the plane, I'm more diligent about having on board safety. Making me go through three different checkpoints doesn't make me feel any safer. Just more annoyed.
Can you tell I haven't been having a good time on my trip yet?! reg
Sonic reg
Sorry, been having been airport experiences lately. I understand the need for "heightened security measures" but I don't see why airport employees feel the need to treat everyone like a terrorist, especially when virtually everyone is cooperating with them.
They put me through the ringer and then some when I flew to Atlanta this past weekend. They "randomly" chose me to get patted down and searched. Ok, fine. Pat me down and run a metal detector over me (even though I JUST went through the other metal detector and didn't get a BEEP). They also searched my carry-on bag by hand (grr.. I don't like random strangers putting their hands all over my underwear). My checked luggage also got "randomly" x-rayed, which meant I had to sit in a dirty room for 30 minutes until they checked it and cleared me. One woman had been there for over an hour and missed her flight because of it. Most of the airport employees were incredibly rude and snapped at me (and I was actually very nice to them and cooperated fully with all their searches).
It makes me really sad that $15 billion of our tax dollars went to bail their sorry arses out. Unfortunately I have to fly again soon because I don't want to put another 3000 miles on my car and spend 2 days driving to and from Miami to visit my parents for the holidays. reg
quote:
I hope they do go ahead and pass whatever bill it is that will allow pilots and such to carry pistols.
That is the most ignorant idea ive ever heard...lets allow GUNS on planes so when something happens the pilot can fire it, have a chance at missing the person, the bullet go through the side of the plane and then everyone dies anny ways...OR...the person overpowers the pilot, and gets the gun...I think allow guns on a plane in anny way is a dumb idea.
-John
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-bReAkZ nATiOnZ-
- breakznation@aol.com
- AIM: highlord42o
[This message has been edited by GOD (edited 12-25-2001).] reg
quote:
That is the most ignorant idea ive ever heard...lets allow GUNS on planes so when something happens the pilot can fire it, have a chance at missing the person, the bullet go through the side of the plane and then everyone dies anny ways...OR...the person overpowers the pilot, and gets the gun...I think allow guns on a plane in anny way is a dumb idea.
Speaking of ignorance, you are obviously more guilty of it. First of all, you think that they would arm pilots with guns capable of shooting through the fusalage causing rapid decompression. That is a very stupid counterargument.
quote:
It makes me really sad that $15 billion of our tax dollars went to bail their sorry arses out. Unfortunately I have to fly again soon because I don't want to put another 3000 miles on my car and spend 2 days driving to and from Miami to visit my parents for the holidays.
Their sorry arses? It's because of liberal morons that those scumbag muslims were able to take down the planes. God forbid some fat old jew* has to open their goddamn bag at the airport and get it checked. People bitch and bitch and bitch about getting hassled, so the airlines back off. Then Mohammed Atta and friends decide to exploit this self induced weakness and people like you and apparently GOD cry about the crack down. Grow the [edit] up sometime. You people are so oblivious I really am shocked to at least think that it's possible for you to function reasonably well in society having such a sheltered and ideaistic mindset. I guess though that the corral of society was built around the sheep.
Sonic
* I used that stereotype on purpose because the type of person it implies is a very good representation of ones that indirectly caused this. If you are offended, I don't care, but here is at least a reason for the rest of you that might have been wondering. reg
quote:
Originally posted by GOD:
That is the most ignorant idea ive ever heard...lets allow GUNS on planes so when something happens the pilot can fire it, have a chance at missing the person, the bullet go through the side of the plane and then everyone dies anny ways...OR...the person overpowers the pilot, and gets the gun...I think allow guns on a plane in anny way is a dumb idea.-John
I'm sure the United States Government would not consider having the flight crew carry guns that would cause damage to the plane itself, resulting in EVERYONE dying. Of course the gun would use a special type of bullet. What kind, I don't know, I am not too knowledgeable in that area, But I know it was suggested by the government.
If you think about it, an armed flight crew is a more effective way of keeping people safe while they fly, for obvious reasons: If somehow someone makes it past security carrying items with that kind of malicious intent (which can and has happened), everyone else while in the air isn't as vulnerable to whatever they want to do with about 5 or more staff carrying pistols. Say the guy with the C4 in his shoes wasn't alone, or there weren't any doctors with drugs to sedate him on board. He would have had a better chance at igniting his shoes. Then what? More flags to fly? More candles to light?
[This message has been edited by Weedmage Princess (edited 12-25-2001).] reg
As an "old fat Jew," as you so gracefully put it, I can tell you from personal experience that I have *no problem whatsoever* with the airports taking whatever time is necessary to check whatever bags I carry, including a full body search if they determine there's a bonafide reason for it.
In fact, ask any "old fat Jew" who travels to or from Israel using El Al Airline, and they'll tell you they've been experiencing the same kind of security for decades. That's their policy and has been since the airline opened for business. If only those countries NOT run by "old fat Jews" would adapt the same policies, maybe we wouldn't be in this situation to begin with.
Roberta, the old fat Jew
reg
quote:
Originally posted by Desharei:
I think it would be helpful if y'all would quit with the stereotyping.As an "old fat Jew," as you so gracefully put it, I can tell you from personal experience that I have *no problem whatsoever* with the airports taking whatever time is necessary to check whatever bags I carry, including a full body search if they determine there's a bonafide reason for it.
In fact, ask any "old fat Jew" who travels to or from Israel using El Al Airline, and they'll tell you they've been experiencing the same kind of security for decades. That's their policy and has been since the airline opened for business. If only those countries NOT run by "old fat Jews" would adapt the same policies, maybe we wouldn't be in this situation to begin with.
Roberta, the old fat Jew
ah, but only if the 'murrican security people were even 1/10 as competent as the El Al people...
If they were, then little old ladies and pregnant women and airline pilots wouldn't get harassed NEARLY as much as those who fit the profile of....
oh.... wait a sec...
you PC types think that profiling is eeeevil...
guess what.. it WORKS! It's a very effective law enforcement tool, which is why the PC crowd hates it...
what's a white guy doing in a black neighborhood? More likely than not, buying crack...
Hey, look at the middle eastern looking guy who is carrying no luggage, yet he's going to Miami for 16 days.. He also has a blank look on his face when he's not staring hatefully at the other passengers...
you think maybe he's planning something? Nah.. we can't judge him based solely on that.. it might offend him!
Merry Christmas!
Festive Festivus!
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Diplomacy is the art of saying "Nice doggie"....
until you can find a rock! reg
I thought this was the poorest example of a stereotype and I still don't see how it applies.
Since when do "fat old jews" have a problem with security? I'm friends with MANY jews both young and old, fat and skinny, and most of them will tell you that hightened security is something they WANT. Heck, just read what jewish business executives have to say about the hightened security. I don't have the slightest clue where that example came from. Infact as Desharei pointed out, Tel Aviv's airport is THE safest airport in the world because of its hightened security checks.
Furthermore Tel Aviv's airport is so renowned for its safety and safety checks that the head of security of that airport has now been assigned to Logan International Airport in Boston. Incase you didn't know, Logan International Airport was the airport where the planes took off that attacked New York.
Come on folks... let's drop the stereotyping and pulling out the ignorance card. Stereotyping is ignorance itself and I'm surprised anyone would stereotype and call someone else ignorant in the same post.
I think what's being pointed out is this. People are being searched for hours, missing their flights because of it, being hassled and treated rudely which leads to frustration, and for what? Someone was still able to shove it to the airports and get on a plane with C-4. If it weren't for his stupidity that plane would have blown, it wasn't the doctors who sedated him or even the people who brought him down that stopped the plane for blowing, it was his own stupidity that C-4 doesn't ignite that saved the day. If he weren't so dumb he would have simply brought one battery, some tin foil a wire and pow, the plane would be out and not a thing anyone would have been able to do to stop it.
If we're to highten security, we should take the APPROPRIATE measures to highten it. I think the frustration comes from the fact that there are all these new measures inplace that are irritating and frustrating and still someone is able to bring C-4 on a plane.
Having said that pilots shouldn't get guns since pilots aren't trained for law enforcement nor should they be. The general pilot is inexperience when it comes to handling something like a hijacking and this would only cause a pilot to become nervous. Because of this I think instead of the pilot carrying a gun there should be a marshal, soldier, police officer, or a specifically trained unit(s) to deal with terrorism aboard airplanes. These units would be allowed to carry a gun or whatever tool nessecary to effectively stop any threat aboard the airplane.
- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard
[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 12-25-2001).] reg
-John
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-bReAkZ nATiOnZ-
- breakznation@aol.com
- AIM: highlord42o reg
There's more to not wanting pilots to carry a gun than shooting a hole in the wall, there's shooting another passanger. That's why I stand by my statement that if anyone is to carry a gun onboard a plane it be someone specially trained. I know there are definitely pilots trained to use a gun and when to use one, and perhaps those specific pilots could be issued one (airforce pilots in particular), however in general I don't think most pilots do have the training or experience to handle something as serious and dangerous as a terrorist.
- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg
R
reg
I've never heard of a cop having his gun stolen from him. If a pilot were armed, I doubt anyone would be able to walk up to him and grab his gun. It's just not likely to happen.
- Lord Kranar, human Archwizards reg
As far as the training for firearms go, that part in the academy for the NYPD is pretty intense. I have heard of maybe one or two instances where an officer lost their gun to an attacking perp, but usually it was because the perp was armed to begin with--also in both cases the officer had another gun.
Also, from my understanding, (correct me if I'm wrong) the most recent hijackers did not carry guns--like the WTC hijackers had boxcutters and such. I'll give credit where it's due, I *do* think the security at the airports is competent enough to not allow passengers with firearms on board. I think a possible hijacker, even if more than one, made their attempt it would be foiled by the crew, especially if there are a few of them with pistols.
Maybe it would be a bit much for the pilot to carry a weapon but what about some of the other flight crew? Maybe there should be armed guards as well--their sole job being on board security. Yeah it might cost a little more but I think it would definitely make many feel better about flying, hence increasing ticket sales..and I'm sure it'll be cheaper than the lawsuits they'll be looking at from grieving family members of their deceased customers.
Maybe they can carry guns loaded with tranquilizers or something, like the doctor did in that Jurassic Park video game..heh.
[This message has been edited by Weedmage Princess (edited 12-25-2001).] reg
quote:
Originally posted by Weedmage Princess:
I'm sure they had something else in mind, another type of bullet or something.
They do. I don't remember the exact name, but the bullet is designed to crush itself on an impact with a hard surface (steel for example). It doesn't penetrate. reg
And let's face it, security is just taking longer, it really isn't all that much better. And most airlines that I've seen have done last calls at the security gate, and allowed their passengers in danger of missing their flight to go to the head of the line, at least they've done it for flights I've been on.
I'm still getting through with metal nail files, and my other assorted manicure tools that are in the bottom of my purse. If you really wanted to get through the security gates with some sort of knife, I sincerely doubt it would be that difficult. Anyone halfway crafty could figure something out. And racist or not, I am SURE that stereotyping is one of the factors in who is getting a closer look when it comes to searching the bags, and body searches. The rest of the people are more of a cover than anything else. It's just a shame C-4 is plastique, and doesn't get set off by metal detectors. Is there some way to standardly check for it? Do dogs sniff it?
And not wanting to get on a plane with someone of Arabic descent is understandable, although YOU are the one who should get off. Just because you are paranoid doesn't mean OTHER people should be inconvenienced or harrassed. I hope that someday, you experience the joys of prejudice. Then perhaps you will change your outlook on life.
Aerienne reg
quote:
Originally posted by Weedmage Princess:
I'll give credit where it's due, I *do* think the security at the airports is competent enough to not allow passengers with firearms on board.
********************************************
I'd like to retract that statement, please.
MEMPHIS, Tennessee (CNN) -- A Florida man who was arrested on charges of carrying a loaded gun in his carry-on luggage was on a one-day round trip to Memphis apparently trying to beef up his frequent-flier mileage, according to the FBI.
The Florida resident boarded a Delta flight Friday morning in Tampa and flew to Atlanta, Georgia, where he switched planes without leaving the secure area of the airport and flew on to Memphis International Airport, Anthony said.
reg
The random one makes me want to punch something. On the last leg of my trip coming home, my bags were checked twice. It was just a coincidence I was the randam gal at both the gate and before getting on the plane.
One of the times they found my mini sewing kit and questioned the sewing needles, which are less than two inches long. Look, if I can hijack a plane with sewing needles, we have more problems than the passengers with dangerous items. We need to re-evaluate the competency of the flight crew. Sewing needles indeed.
Just out of curiousity, for those that have already flown with our improved fandangled security, if they took something away, how did you get it back?
I overheard a girl say her hair clips were taken away because they were of a certain length, and was wondering how to get them back. She also said they should incorporate a mini post office cart at the checkpoints so that if they find something on you and take it away, that you can mail it to where you're going, back home, or wherever.
::chants and rallies:: Inflight safety, inflight safety! reg