The Players Corner Archive

Is it to have fun in a general way? Do you have a level goal?

I hear people say the freeze training to go for fame, or stop training after 50th so that they can merchant their way to the top. Or people who just want to stay around 20th train and RP their whole time.

I placed this in concerns, simply because I think that with so many "goals" are any of them possibly considered out of character.

I would be interested to hear what people goals in the game are, if they have any. Also I would like them to comment on their goals as they would relate if this was a "real" world, and their characters are living breathing people.

What do you see them doing?

Also the reason I posted this in concerns is many players feel that RP is gone from the game, and that almost everyone's goal is to have X amount of coins and X amount of levels.

This is not a test, nor is it a slam towards anyone. If you want X amount of coins and X amount of levels, and thats your goal, say it here and be proud of your goal.

I for one have several goals, however to mention most of them would give away most/all my characters, which some of you interact with quite a bit and just don't know it. Because of the sterotyping done in the game I don't feel comfortable listing them.

But I will list a few.

My merchant character has a goal of 200m liquid cash in the bank.

My empath, beable to kill/skin and make a small fortune, and be one of the most undemanding loving characters in the game.

Me cleric, to be one of the most loyal Luukosian clerics around.

My ranger, to be high on the fame lists, be a great duler, have the guts to standup for people, defend honor and integrity with a tenacious voice.

My wizard(s) to be a master of the elemets. Calm and enjoyable to be around when they aren't frying eyes out, but if you get them on your bad side...watch out.

My rogue, simply put, to be a little of Juspera, Esserae, Ylena, Prata, Aubery, Rlen, Jaxia and a few select others. Basically a wonderfull friend to just "hang out".

Those are some of my goals in a very non-specific way. As you can see I have both level and monetary goals in the game along with RP goals. I think you can have a balance and still enjoy the game and let everyone else enjoy it around you.

Buckwheet reg

My empath dreams of being the most helpful and well-known empath in the lands, and hopes to be able to perform rescue missions anywhere in Elanthia with little or no help. He tends to be mature but has an odd sense of humor at times... enough said.

My warrior hopes to become a legendary fighter for the cause of the just. He tends to be childish and looks to everyone around him for support and adoration.

My rogue wishes to be the greatest treasure hunter in the lands, being able to pick any lock deftly and to be able to survive anywhere in the known realms. He tends to vary his moods, ranging from being inquiring and curious, to being lovable and talkative, to being a downright narcissistic(sp?) ass. It justs depends on what is going on around him.

Level and coin play a part in what I do with my characters but they are not what is most important to any of them... well, except maybe the rogue.

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Caels Onae'Rae
AIM : Caels OnaeRae
MSN : Caels_Onaerae@hotmail.com
ICQ : 91446467
Yahoo!: caels_onaerae

[Edited for spelling... and for the adult photograph my empath left sitting on the page. Last edit done for vulgarity of another version of the word 'ass']

[This message has been edited by Caels (edited 08-26-2001).] reg

Courtine wanted to spend the rest of her life singing and dancing and smashing ice trolls for kicks and giggles.

Neither of these goals required high levels or lots of coins, though with Bestatte I think I'd have liked her to be able to get into the rift, if only just to experience it. Courtine was unviable past level 25 and I knew that after around level 5, so it she was really just the pure RP character for me.

R
reg

Making friends, and doing heroic deeds always made things interesting as well. reg

Hmmmm...

For my players...exceed the commonly stated quotes that non-optomized folks can not succeed in any format.

For my GM persona, to offer exemplary RP opportunities, and create a fun atmosphere you all want to play in.

For my merchants, to craft the most amazing items, no matter in what medium I choose to work in.

For me personnally, to have the respect of my friends, my peers, and my superiors, in all facets of my life.

Khaladon reg

My sorcerer was to be a dark elf who did not agree with the way people treated the dark elf kind. He did not respect sylvankind, half elf, or halflings. He wanted people to other races to think that dark elf was supperior.

My first rogue was a very grumpy rogue. He simply just sat at the glatoph arch and theft from people all day. His role play wasn't very good but he made good silver. I was too much focused with my other characters to get him past 23 and actually do something with him.

My final character was an all around character. He was very strong, yet sneaky for a giantman. He like to show off his strengths although he had a very soft side to him. He did not consider himself a rogue yet his goal was to learn all the rogue guild skills but yet not be disgraced with the name or a rogue. He was considered to be a healer. Another goal of his was to keep River's Rest alive. He traveled up and down it helping injured souls.

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Lord Deprav
Who likes to smash hobbits reg

I remember never being able to make a deal with you because of your prices. You also was a very shrewed mechant that people warned me away from. Also about that bragging right of yours...2bil in items before you became a GM.

But, you do have some wonderful NPC's. Some of the better ones.

Also, don't insult me over IMs saying that so and so is a GM. When you are one and they are not. Just messing with my head?

What is funny. Remember when you refused to make me that custom drink when I got picked? I got it after all. But with another body....Jokes on you now.

I will restrain myself now from telling all........Just has to call you on your goals.

My goals is wealth and fun. Like others. I only stayed for friendships I have made.

edge reg

After spending a good deal of time RPing, working on a quest, and other things, I felt it was time to give back to the game, in return for the joy I have received from it. So, when I was asked to apply to be a Host, I did, and later I applied to be a GM.

A lot of the people who apply to be Hosts and GMs share the same feeling.

--A. reg

Hmmm....

I honestly don't know anymore.

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Have you ever heard of laughing death? It's a disease that causes the brain to rot and deteriorate until the person dies. Now that I think about it, it's not that funny. reg

So perhaps that is what keeps me coming back to Elanthia. The feeling I get when I experience something new in the lands. Also, this is what drives my character development as of late. I have one of each class, whom I hunt and explore in every area I can find. Often times, I find myself simply wandering the lands, reading the descriptions of the rooms, marveling at the effort that has gone into the development of GS.
reg

I can be happy, grumpy, snotty, friendly, helpful, uptight, provocative, whatever I want. I can go beat the crap out of critters, help people in the guild, go on rescue missions, steal, heal, give stuff away to new folks just popping out of the blind alley, get into arguments with people (and keep it IC!), hang out with friends, be silly.

And whatever I want to do, whoever I want to be, I can be that way for an hour or two, and then go back to myself, my own life, having released a little steam or had a little fun or made a new friend. For the time I was in the game I might have had an affect on someone else's mood (hopefully for the better). And playing usually improves my mood as well. It's a fun release.

GG reg

As for my cleric, i plan to make him best damn mana machine the lands have ever seen,grin.

reg

to drink... reg

quote:

---

Originally posted by Rhain:

to drink...

---

I'm her to make people angry!

J/K

My main reason for staying as I've stated is friends. Friends and fellowship is what have kept this game going for me. I've tried venturing off into other RPG's...but they just didn't have any of the friends that I've made here in GS. It just didn't happen.

Not only friends...but good and bad times. I remember lots of old friends that I've seen gone, come back, and gone again. Friends that I'll never see again I'm sure. The ability to say...hmm...Masone? Ya I knew him. Or...Odds...gosh...first wizzie to learn 925...'course I met'm.

It's always fun to go through the old kelfour's editions...talk about some history.

That's what interests me.

And Celtar...I know you can agree with me on the player history idea. reg

There are two separate views that I have of why I am in Gemstone. An out-of-game reason, and an in-game reason.

OOG, I'm back in the game (after having left for a eighteen months after a 6 year stint)because:

a) It's cheap entertainment. I don't have much money, and most of what I do have is spent on bills, living expenses and trying to save up for a house of my own.

b) I moved to the city I live in about three years ago, and I only have a few close friends. Perversely, the friends I do have I know from Gemstone.

c) I dislike the bar scene, I'm not much on sports, and coming back to the money thing, there's not a lot you can see and do without money to get you there (admission to events, gas, parking, time for travelling, etc.)

d) Having always been creative, with a vivid imagination, I enjoy having a venue where I can be anything I want to be, to escape from the real world and live a life more exciting than the real world is for me at this stage in my life.

Now, for the in-game reasons...

a) My empath, who I still have (despite coming back after 18 months only to have every other person ask me if I'm still "me") started out just wanting to make friends and had the idealistic view of helping those in need. Over the course of her lifetime she became the protector of the empath class, the one who raged against discrimination for empaths, deviled the GM's into making changes, was outspoken and blunt and used her influence and sheer persistance as a sort of semi-rage to fuel her into action.

What's amusing to me is that after coming back after an 18 month absense, and with all the changes (95% for the better), the rage is gone. The empaths she encounters now seem so - bland. And without that rage to keep her going, she's like a deflated balloon. I rarely play her simply because there's no "cause" for her to take up and run with. At least, I haven't discovered one for her yet.

When I created my rogue, my goal was to be the biggest, notorious thieving flirt in the lands. And she was well on her way, but I dislike negative conflict and found myself dealing with it because of the way I played her. Jealousy from other women caused some pretty silly, petty arguments, so I toned it down and chose one from the dozens of admirers I'd gathered and settled down. I really wish I could be a little more thick-skinned with her. I do miss her mischievious tricks and wiles while she was emptying some poor love-stricken lad's pocket.

My point - we all play for different reasons, and goals change during the play of your character. Both of my main characters have changed goals and direction since they were conceived, and that's what keeps them interesting, to a degree. It's also what keeps me in the lands, seeing what will come my way next. reg

Sonic reg

Mike

Zanagan reg

1. Have fun. Maybe I won't be the most optimized character, but I'll have fun doing whatever I can.

2. Fashion! Gotta make sure all my things match, even if it means replacing my gear when I get a new weapon.

3. Well, a little less noble: kill time at work. What can I say, I have something like 5 hours a day where I'm doing nothing at work; what better to do?

That's about all for now... trying to get active again.

Chris reg

That was the first year, and character, a warrior. He was boring, I saw all these neat spells and such, so I decided I wanted a few of them, but still be able to beat up greater orcs and such. So I decided to become a ranger.

Well, that didn't last long, he was poorly trained, in ranged weapons mainly, thinking that somehow he had missed the shops that sold them, so I trained him almost to 20 then gave up.

My current character, still a ranger, has managed to have much more staying power. I am now here to see all the new things that keep happening, and to try my best to have some of those happen in Solhaven, the city I've come to like the best. I'm really here to make sure that Solhaven can become a proper city, and to experience the changes associated with that. After that, who knows, I may stay around if Solhaven turns out to be as good as it seems like it will be, or I may leave for good.

Heh, now that they've brought PC back though, that gives me another reason for being here.

-Revalos reg

You're all still playing GS because you're hopelessly addicted, like i used to be...

Hell, I quit enjoying GS back in early '98, but I was so addicted that I just couldn't quit playing...

GS cost me my dream house (I didn't want to work, I just wanted to play), almost cost me my wife (she thought I hated her guts because I snapped at her for bothering me while trying to title the third time!), cost me countless jobs (i didn't work at work- I played GS!).

Now that i have seen what the game made me become (an a-hole bum), and have seen what people thought of the way I played (a guy playing the girliest girl you ever saw, and NO ONE knew for 3 years...LOL), and with the coming death knell of GS (breakage), I figured it was time to either break the addiction or blow my brains out.

Have fun!

Buy my cleric! I need a dual carb intake for my Bella, and they're waaay expensive....LOL

[This message has been edited by formercleric (edited 10-02-2001).] reg

But I hear ya when people are trying to talk to you while your like hunting or something and you just nod your head in response to everything they say cause you are trying to concetrate..and later that day they are like.."so did you pick up those groceries?" and im like "wtf are you talking about?!?"

Mike

Zanagan/Zarosa reg

Don't blame addictions and problems in life on the game. Blame it on yourself for allowing the game to have that much control over you.

::shrugs::
reg

Sonic reg

No one special

[This message has been edited by Bluster (edited 10-03-2001).] reg

Sonic reg

I read the news for about 10 hours a week, I watch T.V probably 10 hours a week to. Hell, I do many things 10 hours a week, I must have problems coming out of the whazoo! Someone help me!

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

Buckwheet reg

Sonic reg

-- David
reg

quote:

---

Originally posted by Chrisidon:
3. Well, a little less noble: kill time at work. What can I say, I have something like 5 hours a day where I'm doing nothing at work; what better to do?

Chris

---

Dang.. where can I get a job like that? What the heck do you do? reg

I started playing Gemstone when I was 11 years old. I had just gotten AOL, and I wanted to be able to play an RPG online. I had been playing the Final Fantasy games since I was like 8 or 9, and loved them. I loved Dungeons and Dragons, even though I could rarely play it because I didn't know very many people who played. So I found the game, rolled up a character, and began playing.

After some time of playing I was here to gain levels and interact with my friends. I always wanted to have a title. Since you had to pay for AOL by the hour back then, I could only play for about 8 hours a month. As you can guess, it took me forever to level, but I didn't care, I was having fun.

When AOL went unlimited, it was wonderful for me. I could play as much as I wanted. But eventually, I grew bored and took a long break (6 months at least, probably more) from the game.

My primary reason for playing Gemstone for a long time was roleplaying. I used to sit in the tavern most of the day and just talk to my friends, getting up to hunt once in a blue moon or so.

Now, I am here to hunt. I grew bored of the lack of roleplaying in Gemstone (or the uniformness that some had... Dark Elves are always evil and grumpy, empaths are always bouncy and giggly, etc.) and now my goal is to see the Rift. I am 18 years old now, and I have been around a pretty long time. My oldest character is only 28. This is mostly because I acctually put school and a social life over Gemstone.

One day, I hope to break the age cap. I hope to have fun along the way. reg

I think I said Gemstone. I did not mention: News, Work, Breathing, Eating etc. Gemstone is none of these.

Bluster

PS.. I also feel those who watch more than 10 hours of TV a week have problems to, but of a different nature. reg

quote:

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Originally posted by Bluster:
PS.. I also feel those who watch more than 10 hours of TV a week have problems to, but of a different nature.

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You could make that argument about anything...

Drinks more than one drink a day, eats something sweet every day, needs to light up a joint/snort coke/shoot heroin once a day...

Some beliefs maintain that all things in moderation are good, I suppose that includes sex, too. Hmmm.

Funny, I'd rather have my kid playing some game on a computer for 10 hours a week than hanging out with a gang down the street.

--A. reg

But then in the summers back then if you go out every night its like.."you should take it easy some night"

"uhh make up your mind bytch"

Mike

Zanagan/Zaorsa reg

--A.>>

I can live with my kid playing on his\her computer for 10 hours a week. 30? 40? 80? Nope, he would loose the PC rather quickly.

Bluster reg

Many people try to compare GS to an addiction. As someone speaking from experience, a ridiculous number of my family members have battled tons of 'addictions' from drugs to alcohol to eating disorders, I still maintain that addcition is MORE of a mind over matter thing. If GS is consuming your life that's your problem. Perhaps you just don't have the will power to do the things you want to do, and decided to blame it all on GS. If your youth or whatever has been 'ruined' by GS, buck up and admit that it was your fault. "Guns don't kill people, people kill people."

Sonic

Editted for stupid typos that really degraded the 'content.'

[This message has been edited by Alfador (edited 10-09-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Alfador (edited 10-09-2001).] reg

First Kelood, now Alfy...what next, we gonna get together and sing Kumbaya?

>Desh mutters obscenities and walks away, shaking her head sadly to herself. reg

I never really had a goal in mind...I just wanted to play...hell I still don't have a goal in mind. Fame, fortune and level just don't seem as important as hanging out with friends and good role playing.

My rogue...well she's my vixen,thief and main character I play.

My cleric...she's the angle, pure and simple, helps people and is a bit soft spoken, she just wants to be able to give life to those in need.

My warrior...she is strong, pushy, brazen,and opinionated. She wants to be the best warrior she can be.

My ranger...she's new, but she just wants to learn and become one with nature...for now.

For me...I just want to enjoy the game, make new friends and have a great time. Besides if you aren't having fun in a game, what's the point? reg

Gemstone is addictive, and most people who play play way too much. No matter what you say, it isnt healthy to sit in front of a computer for 20+ hours a week. It affects eyes, back, wrists and neck, and that is only the physical aspect. I dont think it is healthy to sit infront of a computer on a Friday night, and alot of GSers are doing just that. Go out, have fun.

Also, the argument that playing GS develops social skills is pure BS. Sure you may be able to talk to people when they cant see you, but I would like to see people be so articulate (sp?), so smooth in person.

G
(ramble ramble) reg

I'll tackle this argument idea by idea...

With regards to your coke analogy. In my previous response, I put 'addiction' in quotations for a response. I don't believe that addictions are as strong as the addicts make them out to be. Some people never become 'addicted' to anything, probably because they have stronger will power. I know that there are genetic links to alcoholism and such, however these links merely increase the chances that someone will become 'addicted.' Consider it a -10 will power modifier vs alcohol abuse.

With regards to the fact that players play to much. You cannot define too much. I think you drink too much. If you've had one sip of alcohol, you've got me beat. Am I justified in saying that you have an alcohol problem merely because you're history with it is more extensive than mine? My eyesight is 20/12 uncorrected. Never had glasses, contacts, lasik, anything. I've stared into TVs and computer screen for thousands of hours in my life. I can still easily read the 12 line on an eye chart. However, this is a pretty stupid idea to even argue. I used to skateboard all the time. According to what appears to be relatively popular belief among the nonplayers, anything physical is better than GS. Although I suffered no real permanent damage aside from a clicking ankle, skateboarding is by far a more physically dangerous thing to do than GS. Football is, baseball is, basketball is, hockey especially is, swimming is. If you are going to not play GS much because you are in fear the potential physical ailments associated with typing and reading, I know a guy living in a plastic bubble that I can introduce you to.

I NEVER said that GS develops social skills. I posed a rhetorical question, hoping the reader would consider what a dumb argument the GS kills social skills one is. If you have ever gone to school, you have social skills. If you haven't been able to develop them by the time you graduate, do you really think that there is a ton of hope? I also said that I think the majority of GS players tend to be introverts. GS, for the most part, is a loner game. One person sitting at home interacting with 'characters,' is not really a 'multiPLAYER game.' It's not much different from a video game RPG or whatnot. I'm not trying to take shots at the relationships people online develop, I know they are genuine, however I'm just trying to say that I'm pretty sure most of the players realize that GS isn't a substitute for reality. I guarantee you that everyone has at least some moderate contact with the outside world.

And finally, with regards to my being 'articulate,' who cares. I suck at english and those of you who don't have probably been able to pick that up in my virtually innumerable run ons, comma splices, typos, etc. If you are the type of person that can be more articulate orally than on paper, you are either lying, retarded, or extremely gifted.

Sonic reg

I've seen far too often people who play GS who are depressed playing it, in a very bad mood, sad, or just not playing GS for the sake of having fun but for the sake of being in the game, and I'm wondering, why don't they just exit GS and do something else? The answer, in my opinion atleast, is that they are addicted, they need to play GS even if they aren't happy playing it. They feel some kind of commitment to the game that they have to participate in it to succeed.

I can only call that an addiction, because the same happens with drugs. At first you do drugs because you like the feeling, it makes you happy, feel special, whatever the effect may be, at first most people do drugs because they want to gain a certain effect. Then down the road, they get addicted, and they no longer do drugs to gain an effect, or because they enjoy it, they just do it... even though they're unhappy doing it.

Usually by the time you realize GS or anything is an addiction, it's already too late. That's why the best advice I can give is that when you notice things about your real life crumbling down because of an addiction, do something about it then and there before it becomes a serious problem.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard

[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 10-09-2001).] reg

Playing GS for 20 hours or 50 hours a week doesn't mean a damn in terms of being addicted. That's a very superficial quality to base an addiction on. The most dangerous and brutal addictions only span 20-30 minutes a week.

Also, I won't really argue that there are many people addicted to GS... but honestly it's an addiction that doesn't take much time to break. Based on friends who have quit GS because they felt they were addicted and needed to put it under control, once they stopped playing for 2 weeks, they don't ever feel the need to go back. I guess GS might be something really hard for some people to quit initially because they don't know what else they will do with their spare time, or they think that by not playing GS for that long they will be totally missing out on something very important in the game. But from experience, after a week or two you'll find that time is easily spent doing other things that will take your mind off of GS entirely.

Just my thoughts...

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard

[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 10-09-2001).] reg

So basically, you dont think anyone is really addicted to GS? They just dont have the will power to stop playing? Then wtf is an addiction then?

G reg

quote:

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Originally posted by Krong:
Alfador, you are not making sense.
You can apply your logic to any addiction.
For instance, someone is addicted to coke. You could say that coke isnt addictive, and that person just doesnt have the will power not to do it in excess.

Gemstone is addictive, and most people who play play way too much. No matter what you say, it isnt healthy to sit in front of a computer for 20+ hours a week. It affects eyes, back, wrists and neck, and that is only the physical aspect. I dont think it is healthy to sit infront of a computer on a Friday night, and alot of GSers are doing just that. Go out, have fun.

Also, the argument that playing GS develops social skills is pure BS. Sure you may be able to talk to people when they cant see you, but I would like to see people be so articulate (sp?), so smooth in person.

G
(ramble ramble)

---

Isn't healthy to be in front of a computer 20 hours a week? Gee you should tell OSHA that, and every corporation who hires full time computer operators. I'll bet they'd be interested to hear your theories.

I can attest to the fact that playing RPGs can be habitual, but a "true" addiction requires that something be harmful in order to get that particular label. Text games are not any more harmful than reading novels, or collecting model airplanes (not including the REAL addiction potential for sniffing airplane glue).

It's a habit, and it can be damned difficult to break if you get caught up in it. But it can only hurt your marriage if your marriage wasn't that great to begin with. It can only cause you to lose your job if you've decided (meaning - an actual conscious choice) that your game time is more valueable than your work time.

It can only cause you physical harm if you choose (again, a conscious choice here) to trust someone you've never met based solely on what you read of their typing, and meet them in some private place in real life and they turn out to be a psycho.

Sorry, there's nothing about GemStoneIII or any other text game that I can find to be "addictive." Habit forming sure. Any GOOD hobby is habit forming, that's what makes it a hobby in the first place. Addictive, absolutely not.

R
reg

I think he's saying that there is no objective measurement of what an addiction is. If you stop looking for the superficial qualities of an addiction and look at the more involved properties, you'll see what he means.

Saying that a person who drinks twice a day is addicted to drinking is just as inaccurate as saying someone who plays GS for 20 hours a week is addicted. So what... if I play 19 hours I'm not addicted? Is there some magical occurance that occurs exactly after 19 hours that catagorizes me as an addict? It's a silly statement to make... An addiction isn't about a magical number of hours you spend doing something, an addiction is much more involved than that.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

I will have to disagree with this. An addiction doesn't have to simply be substance, people are addicted to pornography (child porn as well), people are addicted to gambling, and yes, people are addicted to video games.

They lose their marriage over it, they lose their kids over it, their jobs, their lives. Their addiction becomes so strong psychologically that they lose touch with what's real and important in life, they become emotionally attached to their addiction.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard

[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 10-09-2001).] reg

G reg

I also want to say again that I still believe addictions are more of a lack of necessary willpower to overcome than anything else. (secondary reason for this post)

Sonic reg

Then I'd ask you to please make up your mind.

You said an addiction is based on the length of time you spend doing something, you never mentioned anything about side effects, or how it affects your life, or whether it has an emotional control over you. You sided with a very dull, blanket and empty statement that an addiction is when you spend 10 hours a week doing something.

You are wrong.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard

[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 10-09-2001).] reg

Sonic reg

Perhaps here?

"No matter what you say, it isnt healthy to sit in front of a computer for 20+ hours a week"

Doesnt look like it. I understand that it doesnt matter how long you play, you can still be addicted. I chose 20 hours a week because it seemed a reasonable amount of time to classify as addicted.

G reg

I would think you are addicted when you cant stop playing. You need to play. You cant stop playing. When it starts to interfere with the rest of your life. When you cant stop thinking about it.When you spend all of your money, time and effort on the game. And you cant stop.

G reg

Sonic reg

quote:

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Originally posted by Krong:
Roberta, you have got to be joking. Say I play GS everyday, all day. I cant stop playing. I will not stop playing. I have no source of income. I have no friends. I have no life. Would you consider those things normal? I would say that it is a bad side effect.

G

---

I would say you have what the psychiatric medical community would call an obsessive/compulsive personality, and that if it wasn't GS sucking you in it would be something else. I'd say you have some serious issues that have little, if anything, to do with the game itself, but rather with some quirk of your brain that prevents you from interacting with the world from a rational frame of mind.

Anyone who "can't" quit playing Gemstone, but "needs" to quit playing Gemstone, needs more help than simply quitting the game can provide. Leaving a loved and cherished hobby behind for whatever reason can be difficult, whether a text game or a collection or beanie babies. But ruining one's marriage, job, or life over these things indicates something MUCH more significant than the object of your "addiction." It indicates that you have some major coping issues.

R

reg

Now would you say the marriage broke up cause one of em was addicted to drugs or would you say it ended cause one of em had serious mental problems. Id say the drugs.

G reg

G reg

G reg

I do respect your opinion Desharei, however I disagree with the statement. Particularly this part:

<< that alters nothing but the comfort level of your wrist and eye muscles is ludicrous at best. >>

I think GS does more than that for many people. If not, then there wouldn't be a problem. For addicts it distracts them from more serious issues in life and makes them lose track of their priorities. Remember... an addiction need not be physical.

"Huh? My marriage is falling apart, I'm neglecting my kids and I'm doing poorly at work? Ah well no time to worry about that, I've got an invasion to fight in Gemstone."

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

Lord Deprav reg

reg

Internet abuse(of which Gemstone falls under) and its effects are more subtle, but still are proving themselves to be destructive. In the next years as some kids head off to college with the bulk of their dealings with other people in a Cyber form we will see the results of this "harmless" for of entertainment.

Ill stick to my main theme, if you play Gemstone on average more than 10 hours a week you have to step back a take a look. Play more than 30 and you have a problem.

Bluster

PS I play on average 11 hours a week, and yes, I have asked myself, is there something better I could be doing....the answer is usually, yes. reg

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bluster:

Ill stick to my main theme, if you play Gemstone on average more than 10 hours a week you have to step back a take a look. Play more than 30 and you have a problem.

Bluster

PS I play on average 11 hours a week, and yes, I have asked myself, is there something better I could be doing....the answer is usually, yes.

---

Where do you get this information? What research have you done, and what are the sources, that cause you to come to this conclusion? The way you word it, it sounds like you have some sort of empirical data to back up your statement. If, on the other hand, it is merely your opinion, and not a statement of fact as I read it to be, then I'd like to know the basis of your opinion as well.

If you have neither sources to back up the factual statement, nor any basis on which to form your opinion, then both are invalid.

R

reg

An addiction is based on ones psychological and emotional dependance on something. It's not about being happy playing Gemstone 10 hours a week, but instead depending on Gemstone to make you happy 10 hours a week.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

It isn't the game itself that causes the addiction. The game can be "addictive" or "habitual" depending on your preference for semantics. But YOU cause your addiction, not the game. Relying on outside sources, no matter what they are, to provide you with happiness for however long is indicative of a problem. The outside sources are benign until and unless you attach yourself to them to the point where you feel "bad" without them.

This applies to anything, and doesn't necessarily equate with "wrongness" as in the case of breathing, eating, and sleeping.

If you "need" a game in order to be happy with your life then yes there is something wrong. But it's something wrong with YOU and not with the game.

R
reg

Oh, I agree with you as far as the concept goes, but I disagree on the issue of semantics.

I would define Gemstone as the addiction, just as I would define gambling an addiction, cigarrets, porn, playing Pool on Yahoo, whatever.

Take away the addiction (rehab, locking yourself up, whatever works) and the addiction will die. Most non-drug addictions (which includes text games or games in general) die very quickly once the person stops engaging in them and finds something else to do. The problem of course is just getting yourself to stop doing the darn thing in the first place.

I'm sure that someone well educated in these issues would be able to list qualities that would make a certain action addictive, and I'm sure they could be able to find several qualities that would make GS addictive. Afterall there's got to be a reason why a lot more people get easily attached and addicted to Gemstone than a toy truck. Certain elements must be present and I would put money on it that GS has several elements.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

Something that attracts in the first place. Like a game, or just as easily, like a collection of Tonka Trucks.

Something that captures your attention once it has attracted you.

Then - here's where the chemical part comes in:

Something that gives you an adrenaline rush. Your body produces its own adrenaline. The attractant makes that bio-hormone burst through the brain. It is a bio-chemical attraction.

But to be addicted - not just enjoy it - there has to be something intrinsically off balance in the brain. Everyone loves an adrenaline rush. But not everyone is addicted to it. People with compulsive disorders will get "caught up" in the rush. People with depression or anxiety disorders will get caught up in it. People whose lives are otherwise meaningless to them because they've chosen to focus on the negative and discount the positive will get caught up in it.

Any of these things in the last paragraph, combined with any of the things in the first two, can potentially cause an addiction.

But the root, the crux of the issue is, the addiction and the responsibility for that addiction lies within the person and not the object to which he has become addicted.

R
reg

The only counter arguement I can make is based on observation, empirical data.

If this were the case I think we'd have many people addicted to toy trucks, or writting the letter K on a piece of paper over and over... many people addicted to the oddest things. The reality is that addictions are usually found in one action more than in another.

I would logically conclude that this is because some actions have more elements of addiction than others. The more elements of addiction something has, the easier it is to get addicted to it and become emotionally dependant on it.

<< But the root, the crux of the issue is, the addiction and the responsibility for that addiction lies within the person and not the object to which he has become addicted. >>

I think this is subjective and dependant on various factors. In some cases it could very well be the person, in others it could be the object they're addicted to.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard

[This message has been edited by LordKranar (edited 10-10-2001).] reg

quote:

---

Originally posted by LordKranar:
10 hours isn't a magical number. There is no transition from playing Gemstone an hour and 20 minutes a day to playing Gemstone an hour and 25 minutes a day.

An addiction is based on ones psychological and emotional dependance on something. It's not about being happy playing Gemstone 10 hours a week, but instead depending on Gemstone to make you happy 10 hours a week.

---

a week?

heh.. try 10 hours a DAY. For 6 years.

did i throw a significant chunk of my life away? Yep!

in '97, I did a tour with a band from Iceland... I was without a computer for a month... I went through GS withdrawls so badly that I would walk miles and miles to get to cyber cafes in NY and SF just to talk to friends in IM's about GS... (GS went to the web while I was gone)

Did I have issues in my life that GS substitued for?
Yep!

Have I sought help for em?

yep! Zoloft does wonders for the depressed...LOL

Do I need to substitute GS for those problems anymore? NOPE!

Y'all have fun breaking the addictions when breakage goes live, since you'll all be quitting then...LOL

Al

reg

Did I have issues in my life that GS substitued for?
Yep!

Have I sought help for em?

yep! Zoloft does wonders for the depressed...LOL

Do I need to substitute GS for those problems anymore? NOPE!

You apparently had a void in your life and filled it with GS. In retrospect, would it have been better to slit your wrists? Do drugs? Have a ton of random sex? Many more people opt for the latter than the prior. This fact leads to a lot of dead people and a lot of hurt loved ones. If your life is such that you 'NEED' to survive, then is that any different than 'NEEDING' zoloft or prozac or xanax or whatever? Depression is not only cured by pills and therapy. Depression can also be cured by constructive reflection and thought. Call me a liar if you want, but it's the truth. I truly am sorry to hear that you feel you waste so much of your life in GS. The only thing worse than regret is treachery. However attempting to drill this idea into other people's heads really isn't fair to them. Perhaps the depressed 16 year old kid who is playing GS 5 or 6 hours a day will decide to goto that party and knock up some drunk girl. I've seen it happen more than once. GS is not an unhealthy outlet. I bet many of the older people here that dealt with social problems, depression problems, whatever problems, before they were really diagnosed will agree with me. I know nothing.

Sonic reg

I for one could leave and never come back, except for a few things. One of them being these boards. I think it would be highly inapproriate for me to sponsor and promote something I no longer would believe in.

However I enjoy the posters and I enjoy the friends I have met along the way. That would be enough for me to sacrifice 10$ a month just to stay current with what my friends are interested in and to also allow me the ability to maintain my integrity as the board owner and admin.

If you want to talk about adictions, well lets see I purposely put on my calander every Sunday night from 8-9pm I am busy during the Soprano's season. I don't answer the phone and I don't go anywhere, if I have to go somewhere I make sure I am home by 7:30 so I can change clothes and pop some popcorn. Sounds like an addiction to me, but once the show is over with will I still do the same ritual? Probably but for some other show. There are some things in life that you as a person HAVE to make time for.

Let me tell you a story quickly and then you can tell me I have an addiction. Because I don't think I do, but I have grown up with this for so long it is part of who I am.

I started playing hockey when I was 4. By 5 I was on a league, and two years later I was on the traveling hockey program in MN. I was rated one of the best skaters in the league and I was a fast learning player. At the ripe old age of 15 when you start full body contact I sent 2 players to the hospital and I made a trip there myself for a dislocated thumb, and one concussion. The following year I dislocated my right knee, and in 6 weeks was back on the ice for practice, but was done for the season. I am missing a fairly large chunk of cartilage in my right knee because of this injury surgery was recomended by three doctors and I said no, put on my skates I am playing. The following year I moved into Varsity highschool hockey. I recieved one seperated shoulder, 3 concussions, a sprained back, and another dislocated thumb, towards the end of the season I dislocated my left knee. Again surgery was required and I said No way in hell! I have summer training camp coming, so I strapped on my skates and played summer hockey made it out with only someone stepping on my thumb and slicing it wide open. The next two years I played with only minor injuries. Went to summer camp and dislocated my rigt knee again. Went to my Senior year playing hockey, sprained my neck and low back when someone cross checked me on my knees. His stick hit me right in the face, flipping me over backwards. During training I was running the mile on a tread mill, got dizzy and passed out, my right hand followed the belt into the gear box. Nothing broken, but a severly strained and sprained right hand. I graduated and moved to play Div. One hockey. During training camp I was lucky enough to fall at a very bad time, I took a 90-100mph slap shot to the back of the head which knocked me out cold and gave me my last concussion. I came back to find I was cut from the team, and had to play minors, I played in the minors and suffered a severed bicept tendon in my right shoulder, which I still have not fixed.

Now that you have read that probably incredibly boring story, do you find it odd or addicting that every fall when the leaves start to turn, I get down my pair of skates and lace them up? That I start taping up a pair of hockey sticks waiting for the ice to come? Or how about the fact that I get out my hockey gloves and rub oil into the worn leather palms and the smell....

It smells as if I am right back to where I was. Do you find it odd that when I walk into the arena for the first time you pause, look around and take in the smell of the freshly shaved ice as the zamboni is re-surfacing?

Or do you find it odd that no matter what the price I paid, or will pay I still play the game, and no matter what happens to me I will play untill I can't, and then I will skate untill I can't, and then I will look our the window of the nursing home as the first snow flakes begin to fall and I shed I silent tear as I wish with all my heart that I could go outside and skate just one final time before I die?

Now you tell me, what in the hell is so wrong with loving something so much, that no matter what happens, no matter how much physical and mental anquish you have to deal with, that you will always cherish and remember the times you had doing that event.

I for one can't find one damn thing wrong with it.

Buckwheet reg

1. Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.
An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.

2. The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.
An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

courtesy of dictionary.com

*******************************************
I can't believe you people argued that much over what addiction is.

I think your all just addicted to posting...

'lood

reg

<<As the incidence and prevalence of Internet Addiction Disorder (IAD) has
been increasing exponentially, a support group, The Internet Addiction
Support Group (IASG) has been established. Below are the official
criteria for the diagnosis of IAD and subscription information for the IASG.

Internet Addiction Disorder (IAD) - Diagnostic Criteria

A maladaptive pattern of Internet use, leading to clinically significant
impairment or distress as manifested by three (or more) of the following,
occurring at any time in the same 12-month period:

(I) tolerance, as defined by either of the following:

(A) A need for markedly increased amounts of time
on Internet to achieve satisfaction

(B) markedly diminished effect with continued use
of the same amount of time on Internet

(II) withdrawal, as manifested by either of the following

(A) the characteristic withdrawal syndrome

(1) Cessation of (or reduction) in Internet use
that has been heavy and prolonged.

(2) Two (or more) of the following, developing within
several days to a month after Criterion 1:

(a) psychomotor agitation
(b) anxiety
(c) obsessive thinking about what is happening
on Internet
(d) fantasies or dreams about Internet
(e) voluntary or involuntary typing movements
of the fingers

(3) The symptoms in Criterion 2 cause distress or
impairment in social, occupational or another
important area of functioning

(B) Use of Internet or a similar on-line service is engaged in
to relieve or avoid withdrawal symptoms

(III) Internet is often accessed more often or for longer periods of time
than was intended

(IV) There is a persistent desire or unsuccessful efforts to cut down
or control Internet use

(V) A great deal of time is spent in activities related to Internet
use (e.g., buying Internet books, trying out new WWW browsers,
researching Internet vendors, organizing files of downloaded materials.)

(VI) Important social, occupational, or recreational activities are
given up or reduced because of Internet use.

(VII) Internet use is continued despite knowledge of having a persistent
or recurrent physical, social, occupational, or psychological
problem that is likely to have been caused or exacerbated by
Internet use (sleep deprivation, marital difficulties, lateness for
early morning appointments, neglect of occupational duties, or
feelings of abandonment in significant others)>>

Just something to review.

Bluster

reg

Sonic reg

Just like OCD - it can be manifest in a myriad of symptoms. Excessive hand washing, constantly returning home after stepping foot outside to see if the stove REALLY is turned off, trichotilomania (hair pulling).. none of these are a CAUSE. They are all SYMPTOMS. The mind is the cause. Something wrong with the mind. Whether it's a chemical imbalance that makes someone become obsessively attracted to something, or whether they are simply miserable wretches with no lives, the facts are the facts. Gemstone does NOT cause addictions.

Roberta
reg

I think however you're begging the question.

I simplify your arguement to mean that "You're addicted to Gemstone because YOU're addicted to Gemstone."

That's fine, I can't really argue with that infact there is nothing illogical about it. However, I don't think the above is the only reason why an addiction occurs, only because like I said earlier... if that were the case then we'd have just as many people addicted to writting on a piece of paper the letter Z as we have people addicted to playing Gemstone.

I argue that the reason we don't is because certain actions have more elements of addiction than others. If Gemstone were nothing more than a game where one pushes the button X as many times as he could against other people then I think it's safe to conclude that not as many people would be addicted to it then the way it is now. But

I think GS is something that does contain elements of addiction, and because of that people who do play GS and do enjoy it should keep that in mind and keep it under control so that they don't become so attached to how happy GS makes them feel.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

This is because, when you become emotionally dependant on something, and need that something to make you happy, then you miss out on so many other qualities and things in life. Why go out on vacation to have fun when you can have all the fun and happiness you want (and more) getting high, or getting drunk? Why read a book, watch T.V, go with friends, play sports, hang out, do whatever to have fun when you have it all playing GS?

For most who are addicted to something, they will most likely have a lot more fun and happyness engaging in their addiction then doing anything else. But then they also become very dull, 2 dimensional, all they want, all they need is their addiction and nothing else really matters.

That in itself is the worst aspect of an addiction. I'm not just talking about GS here... I'm talking in general. Addictions make you lose out on a lot in life because the addiction becomes all you need.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

Why is it so important to label what is or isn't addicting or unhealthy behavior when we in this medium have no real way to verify anyone else's except our own behavior?

I say to each their own. People who are close to players of this game are probably most fit to even attempt some sort of appraisal on how the game affects them.

You are the only one who know's and can state in my opinion in this forum how this game has affected you personally. Addicting, harmful, unhealthy, positive, negative, enhancing, or otherwise. All of those terms are best judged when a player looks truthfully inside themselves.

I can honestly say I have had both positive and negative impacts over the years playing Gemstone. There were times I thought I was addicted where time used to play the game were detrimental to my personal life. There were also periods of time where I thought the game and the environment helped me a great deal. I could use the medium to be creative, interact with new friends in a healthy manner and communicate with my wife when away from home.

There are a good many aspects and I really think simply placing the game as a whole into one neat and simple definition as addictive or not is oversimplifying.

Hiway reg

I don't know if I would agree with that. In general people don't realize they have an addiction until they are confronted by a friend, or someone close to them, or until it's way too late and they have already been affected in a serious way.

It's appropriate to inform others that they should either avoid something harmful (like drugs or addictive substances) or keep something under control (like gambling, or in this case text games). If we don't inform others like our friends, and just sit as it happens, sure it may be legally alright, but I wouldn't feel to good about it personally.

It would be wrong to force someone into not doing it using extreme measures, but there is nothing wrong with teaching and giving words of advice.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

quote:

---

Originally posted by LordKranar:
<< You are the only one who know's and can state in my opinion in this forum how this game has affected you personally. >>

I don't know if I would agree with that. In general people don't realize they have an addiction until they are confronted by a friend, or someone close to them, or until it's way too late and they have already been affected in a serious way.

It's appropriate to inform others that they should either avoid something harmful (like drugs or addictive substances) or keep something under control (like gambling, or in this case text games). If we don't inform others like our friends, and just sit as it happens, sure it may be legally alright, but I wouldn't feel to good about it personally.

It would be wrong to force someone into not doing it using extreme measures, but there is nothing wrong with teaching and giving words of advice.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard

---

Good point. I wasn't very clear and should of emphasized the people who are close in real life to the player's of this game are probably the best equiped and I think when it ultimately comes to head so to speak, the individual has to come to grips with an addiction. Sure others can point to symptoms and ask people to change their ways, but in my experience the only time change truly is elicited is when that same individual admits to themself their problem.

Others can help them come to terms with this, but the ultimate responsibility will always reside with the person who is causal.

Hiway
reg

This I agree with totally. Only when one comes to terms with themselves will they have the courage for change.

- Lord Kranar, human Archwizard reg

I've been living where I am now for almost a year. Being in the game and online is what keeps me near my family and friends. The only friends I have that I see and hang out with are the friends my boyfriend introduced me to. Making new friends is not always easy and I just plain refuse to do the club/bar scene just to meet people. I'd rather stay home and talk to the people I already am familiar with.

My exhusband didn't understand my desires to be on the computer. He couldn't fathom why someone would want to spend hours in front of a screen talking to other people I can't see. We had scores of arguments over it. He wanted to change me into something I'm not. He knew I was a computer person when we met and when we got married. After that, he made sure he knew how miserable he was that I was "ignoring" him, which I wasn't. I would play when he wasn't around, never when we were together. He would call me from work just to see if I was on the computer.

However, he'll never admit that he had his own obsessions.. gaming. He would go to his own D&D games, which HAD to be every Tuesday, rain or shine, sick or healthy, in someone else's home or at a store (at least I was home all the time and he knew where to reach me.. I didn't have that with him), and he had this compulsion to create new characters all the time. My living room floor was always littered with D&D books, character sheets and sketches. This is ok, but my computer fetish isn't? Oh because he sees real people. <rolls her eyes> I talk to real people too... people I like. Not a day from his gaming would he come home and not complain about someone he didn't like that he HAS to play with. But again, this is better than socializing online with people I like. Riiiiight. We broke up for several reasons. One of them was because he had a "feeling" I was cheating on him with someone online so he had an affair of his own. I'm still trying to figure out how talking in IMs equates having sex with an ex roommate. But ya know, socializing with real faces is more important!

I'm sure you all didn't want to hear about my life like that, but I was trying to show that what is one man's addiction is anther man's good time. I never begrudged him a moment of his gaming, but he would make sure he knew how much he hated my computer. Seems there were issues there long before I showed up. And I can't be with someone who doesn't understand this part of me. Luckily now I'm with someone who loves computers just as much as I do. Sometimes we play games together, sometimes we just both happen to be online together and reach over once in a while for a hug, a snuggle or a kiss. And we make sure we have at least one night going out just the two of us, and one night of socializing with our friends. But through and through, we're still junkies and probably always will be.

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~Jeanine reg

Actually things like playing sports, going to school, working(in 99 percent of cases), hanging out with friends(in real life not cyber lies) involve interaction with real people. The addiction issue with the internet is that it allows people to withdraw from reality. Which follows up with this part of my response which involves "CrytsalTears" post.

<<My exhusband didn't understand my desires to be on the computer. He couldn't fathom why someone would want to spend hours in front of a screen talking to other people I can't see. We had scores of arguments over it. He wanted to change me into something I'm not. He knew I was a computer person when we met and when we got married. After that, he made sure he knew how miserable he was that I was "ignoring" him, which I wasn't. I would play when he wasn't around, never when we were together. He would call me from work just to see if I was on the computer. >>

This is a perfect example. People with issues tend to be much more comfortable dealing with people on the internet because they are shielded. Shielded from rejection, intimacy, aggression etc. A lot of alcoholics drink for these same reasons. They can not handle dealing with people other than usually one or two close relationships which invarriably are bad to start with. I tend to agree with those who say people who have what is referred to as Internet addiction really have more serious underlying issues that manifest themselves in addictions.

Bluster reg

quote:

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Originally posted by Bluster:
This is a perfect example. People with issues tend to be much more comfortable dealing with people on the internet because they are shielded. Shielded from rejection, intimacy, aggression etc. A lot of alcoholics drink for these same reasons. They can not handle dealing with people other than usually one or two close relationships which invarriably are bad to start with. I tend to agree with those who say people who have what is referred to as Internet addiction really have more serious underlying issues that manifest themselves in addictions.
Bluster

---

Ok, YOU say I have issues. I don't have issues. Did you even see when I said that I was only on the computer when he wasn't around, or did you disregard that part? I had MANY close relationships when we were married... him, my family, my best friend, my other friends, and none of those were on the internet. As a matter of fact, when I was married, I was online a great deal less than I did when I was separated and alone. I found it very insulting you saying I have issues because I chose my hobby to be computers. You totally disregarded my whole rant about his obsession with D&D games. But that's ok because it's not on the computer right?

Are you sure you're not my ex, because you sure sound like him, or a clone anyway.

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~Jeanine reg

Mike

Zanagan/Zarosa reg